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Fleet Challenge 06-30-08:"Traditional" Grand Melee

 
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Canceled user







Subject: Fleet Challenge 06-30-08:"Traditional" Grand Melee   PostPosted: Mon Jun 30, 2008 5:55 pm Reply with quote

I've been noticing a lot of newer participants in the Armies section posting very large build total fleets, so hopefully this weeks challenge will generate some interest amongst some of these newer folks.

The challenge:

Single Nation fleet; 100 pt. build total

Keep in mind that entries will be judged on a Grand Melee format, not the usual one-on-one matches.

Restrictions/House Rules:

Whitebeard's Raiders is the only faction not allowed.
No treasure.
No Krakens/Octopodes. All other types of sea creatures are OK.
No 0LR crew of any kind. Other 0 cost or cost reducing crew are allowed.
The Eternal Keyword only functions once in the game for each ship/crew possessing it.


Please name you fleets: Name's Grand Melee fleet.
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Canceled user







Subject: Re: Fleet Challenge 06-30-08:"Traditional" Grand M   PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 2:37 am Reply with quote

milbarber wrote:

Keep in mind that entries will be judged on a Grand Melee format, not the usual one-on-one matches.


I'm not sure what you mean by "Grand Melee". I think you mean all of the fleets will be fighting each other at the same time. Anything else we need to know about a Grand Melee scenario? Is it roughly the same as Deathmatch/Last Captain Standing?

You say single nation, but what about ships/crew that allow crew from other factions. Can you use Amos to bring in non-Pirate crew?

Equipment is allowed? How about Mysterious Islands that don't affect treasure?
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Canceled user







Subject:    PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 11:40 am Reply with quote

Ah, it's probably just a different vernacular from venue to venue. At my venue, we call it Grand Melee rather than Last Captain Standing. I'm not sure if a surviving captain crew is required for Last Captain Standing, but in Grand Melee, the player with the last surviving unit that can be given an independent action wins, no captains required.

And yes, all fleets compete against each other at the same time. At my venue, Death Match is still one-on-one battles, not multi-player.

By Single Nation fleets I just mean all ships, sea creatures, and submarines, or any other unit that counts as a "ship" must be from the same nation. Except for the listed restrictions, all printed ability text on cards functions as written.

Equipment and Mysterious Islands are allowed. I figure Mercenaries need some advantage since they can't dock at their home island to repair.
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Canceled user







Subject:    PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 12:43 pm Reply with quote

milbarber wrote:
By Single Nation fleets I just mean all ships, sea creatures, and submarines, or any other unit that counts as a "ship" must be from the same nation.


So, ships that allow other Nationalities, or crew that do the same thing, are allowed?
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Canceled user







Subject:    PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 2:10 pm Reply with quote

Yes, crew such as Anamaria, or ships such as the HMS Grand Temple will allow crew of a nationality different than your fleet in general to be assigned to and use their abilities on the affected ship.

For example, if my fleet consisted of two pirate ships, two pirate sea creatures, and a pirate submarine, I could use Anamaria to assign the English version of Griffin to one of my ships. Similarly, I could assign Lt. Nigel Hardwicke to the same ship as Anamaria. During the game he could leave the ship and still be given actions due to his Marine keyword, but he has to start out on a ship that allows him to use his abilities, either because it is the same nationality or because of an Anamaria-type ability.
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Canceled user







Subject:    PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 4:27 pm Reply with quote

milbarber wrote:
During the game he could leave the ship and still be given actions due to his Marine keyword, but he has to start out on a ship that allows him to use his abilities, either because it is the same nationality or because of an Anamaria-type ability.


That's one thing I never understood. Why are Marines more restricted on a ship than when they are on an island? If a Marine is on a ship, they have to match nationalities or be on a ship that allows their nationality. But, at other times, like when they are on a sub, a Marine is considered separate from the ship they are on.

Personally, I think that the Marine keyword needs to be expanded to allow them to ignore the nationality of the ship that they are on....but that's just me. Very Happy
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Canceled user







Subject:    PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 6:04 pm Reply with quote

captained wrote:

That's one thing I never understood. Why are Marines more restricted on a ship than when they are on an island? If a Marine is on a ship, they have to match nationalities or be on a ship that allows their nationality. But, at other times, like when they are on a sub, a Marine is considered separate from the ship they are on.


Probably because a Marine on a ship can't be shot at. So you can argue they are much more difficult to get rid of while on a ship. Then again, you could also say there are a lot of other ways to deal with a Marine once he's on a ship: sink it, boarding, use "eliminate one crew" abilities, grape shot, etc.

captained wrote:

Personally, I think that the Marine keyword needs to be expanded to allow them to ignore the nationality of the ship that they are on....but that's just me. Very Happy


That would be nice, although thematically it may make you wonder why a French Marine would be found on a non-French ship. The Loyal: and Hostile: keywords address this somewhat (and also allow the point cost to be brought down to a more reasonable 5 points), but these keywords didn't exist when the first Marines were introduced. I really wish we'd had those keywords sooner, since they encourage nation-pure fleets with a somewhat measurable benefit.
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Canceled user







Subject:    PostPosted: Mon Jul 07, 2008 11:59 am Reply with quote

For most of us (ok, all us Yankees) last week was shortened by the holiday. Looks like I was the only one that put a fleet together... unfortunately, I haven't been paying attention to the FAQ, and the main combo for the fleet doesn't work. It's not really fair to win that way... should we extend the Challenge another week?
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Canceled user







Subject:    PostPosted: Mon Jul 07, 2008 1:25 pm Reply with quote

Well, I hope it was just the holiday and not the bland challenge that kept entrants away. If you are interested in submitting a fleet for this challenge, please say so. I have no problem with extending the challenge another week, as long as there is some interest.
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Canceled user







Subject:    PostPosted: Mon Jul 07, 2008 4:22 pm Reply with quote

I posted an entry this morning.
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phymatine
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Joined: 28 Sep 2007
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Subject:    PostPosted: Mon Jul 07, 2008 5:43 pm Reply with quote

I'm willing to put forth a fleet, but I will need a few days.
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Canceled user







Subject:    PostPosted: Mon Jul 07, 2008 8:03 pm Reply with quote

That's sound good. So, if no one objects, we'll say this challenge is extended an extra week. Please have your entries in by early, early next Monday morning at the latest.
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Canceled user







Subject:    PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 10:23 pm Reply with quote

Finally the site is working for me today! Sorry for the late judging, but this is the first time today I've been able to get to the armies section. First off let me say that all 3 entries are really cool ideas and could be very effective fleets.

The Grand Melee format does allow for "ganging up" on your opponent, but it is hard to determine who might be the target of such a strategy. All three fleets have a "slow win" approach, but I guess Darin's has the most likely first strike capability, followed closely by CaptainEd. Phymatine states he'll Mermaid on the first turn, so one of his opponents will be down a Favor of the Gods. Duel could greatly effect the outcome of this melee, depending on which crew was targeted. Lots of variables, so let's just look at each fleet and see how each fares in a worst case scenario.

Phymatine has a really unique fleet. I've always wanted to put together a "fog goon" fleet like this one. Unfortunately, I think the effectiveness of this strategy may be hindered by the fact that, if I were either of the opponents, I wouldn't be using any fog banks. They don't help their strategies. Without more fog bank generation, I think the opponents could stay even out of Mist Walker's striking distance pretty easily. Also the "return portal" strategy would be harmed by the relative slowness of the other fog goons, since it won't help Mist Walker to return home. It can't repair regardless. Worst case for Phymatine would be if CaptainEd dropped off his flotillas and went after the Bloody Blade with rams from both of his big bruiser ships. Unless Lord Mycron had already lost a duel with Davy Jones, that would be one ram from up to 2L+4S away and possibly another from up to 2L away (HMS Titan got its extra action). The point here is that each of these ships has a significant advantage on boarding rolls against the 3 mast (2 or 1 if the ramming rolls succeed) Bloody Blade. The oarsman protects the higher point crew from the first boarding, but after that, what goes, the helmsman or the shipwright? Either one really hurts. Then there is Bratley who can cancel either Jones' copy ability or the copied ability, so then all those British cannons can fire away effectively. And there is still one Favor of the Gods in the game, so the Cursed Zone is toast sooner or later. Lots of cool ideas in this fleet, but unfortunately it just doesn't match up well with the competition. So Phymatine comes in 3rd for this challenge.

CaptainEd has really packed in the firepower, and there's plenty of speed and range available as well. Worst case here would be to lose Mycron to Duel right away and to fall prey to a successful swoop attack-teleport away move by Rancor Claw before realizing Darin had Mycron as well. Even after these losses, the fleet is still effective against everything above the water. Rancor Claw could not stay out of striking distance and still hope to attack and escape after the initial surprise. The big ships with a canceller would still be very effective against the Bloody Blade and the slow fog goons. Unfortunately, with only one canceller, there is no way to combat the submerged opponents and multiple cancellers of Darin's fleet. CaptainEd wins second!

Darin's fleet is pretty slow, but very hard to beat. Worst case here is hard to call since Behemoth can copy any lost crew abilities from surviving versions of Mycron, a canceller, etc., so Duel might not hurt this fleet as much. Any of several calamities might befall Rancor Claw, but with only one opposing canceller in the game, all the submerged units are invulnerable. With a guaranteed Mycron available (at least until CaptainEd loses his), the fleet still has enough speed to do damage with just the submerged subs.

Our winner this week is Darin! Congratulations! Good job to all participants!
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Canceled user







Subject:    PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 2:39 am Reply with quote

milbarber wrote:

Our winner this week is Darin! Congratulations! Good job to all participants!


Wow. I didn't expect to win, after it was pointed out that Woelf shut down the "Multiple Mycron" loophole.

I was working on another fleet, using the two 10-masted Cursed ships with the Eternal keyword, but I was 7 points over and hadn't quite worked out what crew I wanted to keep and what I could trim. I figured a pair of 10-masted ships with a couple Eternal keywords each would just take too darned long to sink, I could outlast everything. But never got around to finishing it. But hey, might as well take the win.

I'll post another fleet challenge Tuesday morning... maybe something with the Cursed.
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