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woelf
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Subject: Re: Interesting interactions   PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 9:33 pm Reply with quote

a7xfanben wrote:
xerecs wrote:
The Pirate Code wrote:
The Hostile keyword applies only when building your fleet and when placing crew from outside of the game.


I assume this means that the keyword applies when used in a non action pure campaign?

For an example, if I wanted to bring in Commodore Peregrine Stern but I had a Spanish ship already in my fleet, I wouldn't be able to do it until that Spanish ship is somehow no longer considered part of my fleet?


I'm not sure if there's an official ruling on that... for flavor purposes I'd prefer that Hostile still applied for CG's when trying to bring new crew into the game.

Or, you could allow it, but if Stern's ship and the Spanish ship were ever in range of each other, they'd have to fire! Surprised Smile (civil war!) (for even more thematic elements, perhaps Stern isn't told that he's being hired into a fleet that has Spaniards working within it as well. Then, when he sees them (perhaps within 3L or something) on "his" side, he flips out and attacks them!)

Might be something you'd have to work out with your fellow pirates.
Situations like this that come up in campaign/Economy/World/etc. games fall under the general section for Variants (it refers mostly to Deathmatch, but the same principles still apply):

The Pirate Code wrote:

House Rules, Scenarios, and Other Variants – Including “Deathmatch”
-Any and all intentional rule changes, variants, or scenarios that will be used during a game should be clearly indicated to all players prior to building their fleets so any necessary adjustments can be made. If used during an event or tournament they must be included in the event description.
-If during the course of a game it is discovered that a “variant” was being used unintentionally, whether due to a misunderstood rule or for any other reason, and it could affect the outcome of the game, players should attempt to come to a consensus on how to resolve it. If an agreement cannot be reached quickly, roll dice or use some other randomization method to decide how to proceed for the remainder of the current game. After the game is completed, players should agree on whether to use the (corrected) official rule or the variant rule in future games.
-Alternative rule sets like the “Deathmatch” style of play, despite their popularity, have never been fully supported by the official rules so many abilities may not function properly and some may even create an unfair or game-breaking advantage. This is not a flaw in the game. If you use house rules to change any aspect of the rules (especially victory conditions) and it creates an ambiguous or game-breaking situation, you should further adjust your house rules to account for it instead of complaining. If adjustments to specific abilities that may be problematic (such as Eternal) have not been provided as part of the rules for the event, players should attempt to come to an agreement on how to handle them prior to building their fleets. If an issue is discovered during play, the players should come to a consensus on how to proceed for the remainder of the game.
-Scenario games are assumed to use all of the standard rules unless specifically noted otherwise in the description.


In other words, it's entirely up to you how to handle Hostile and Loyal in campaign games.
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Subject:    PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 1:47 am Reply with quote

I think I'll go with something similar to what ben suggested. If the hostile crew gets within 2L of whatever it is hostile to, it as to move to attack that piece. Going with my example, if the ship Stern winds up on ever gets within 2L of the Acorazado, then that ship has to move to attack the Acorazado.


On another track, how many times in theory can a ship board another ship? Specifically if it has S-Board and SAC actions available to it. Could you board more than one ship at once, with a ram on one ship, and an S-Board on another ship close by.

I looked at the code and did not find anything conclusive that could prevent multiple boards in one turn.
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Subject:    PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 2:08 am Reply with quote

xerecs wrote:
On another track, how many times in theory can a ship board another ship? Specifically if it has S-Board and SAC actions available to it. Could you board more than one ship at once, with a ram on one ship, and an S-Board on another ship close by.

I looked at the code and did not find anything conclusive that could prevent multiple boards in one turn.
There's no hard limit on how many times or how many ships you can board in a single turn.

Between the standard boarding, additional actions, S-boarding, Switchblade, Scorpion, Claw Cannon, Grapple Shot, and probably one or two other things not coming to mind at the moment, you can stack up quite a few chances.
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Subject:    PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 2:32 am Reply with quote

Thanks, I have plans for the campaign that require boarding ships. Speaking of the campaign, I need to get that Battle Report written....
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Subject:    PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2017 1:56 am Reply with quote

xerecs wrote:
I think I'll go with something similar to what ben suggested. If the hostile crew gets within 2L of whatever it is hostile to, it as to move to attack that piece. Going with my example, if the ship Stern winds up on ever gets within 2L of the Acorazado, then that ship has to move to attack the Acorazado.


I suggest an addition to this. If the one ship moves into 2L of the ship or crew that is hostile to it then instead of having the ownin player launch the attack say that the player to his right gives the hostile ship an action to attack. This would avoid a player trying to make a weak attack because he owns both ships. i.e. "darn the sails block the rear cannons so only one cannon can fire".
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Subject:    PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2017 3:32 am Reply with quote

Aha, I think that will work very well, thank you ectmn.
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Subject:    PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2017 1:14 am Reply with quote

Can I use Jailhouse Dog to eliminate a Maps of Alexandria that was turned face up by Pirate Globe?
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Subject:    PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2017 6:00 pm Reply with quote

Another interaction question.
UT's are transferable, unless stated otherwise, correct? For example, if I found Neptune's Trident on one ship, I could give it to another ship to use.

What would happen if Homemade Flag found it's way onto a ship that could not be shot at within S, and is the flag transferable without UT moving crew like Rollando?

Lastly, the gallery lists Devereaux as hostile France, but his card says hostile pirate. I assume the card is correct?
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Subject:    PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2017 7:06 pm Reply with quote

a7xfanben wrote:
Can I use Jailhouse Dog to eliminate a Maps of Alexandria that was turned face up by Pirate Globe?
Yes, but... why?
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Subject:    PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2017 7:13 pm Reply with quote

xerecs wrote:
Another interaction question.
UT's are transferable, unless stated otherwise, correct? For example, if I found Neptune's Trident on one ship, I could give it to another ship to use.
Correct, UTs can be transferred unless they specifically say otherwise.

Quote:
What would happen if Homemade Flag found it's way onto a ship that could not be shot at within S, and is the flag transferable without UT moving crew like Rollando?
Homemade Flag on one of those ships is going to be a serious problem for opposing players, but they can still ram & board to potentially steal it that way. If you managed to derelict the ship, you could explore it and/or tow it.

Otherwise, you'll need someone like Rollando or David "Bones" Wiley to swipe it without necessarily disabling the ship first.

Quote:
Lastly, the gallery lists Devereaux as hostile France, but his card says hostile pirate. I assume the card is correct?
The card is always correct unless the PC specifically says otherwise. There's some other weird stuff going on with hyphens/dashes in that gallery text, so whoever put it in originally must have copied from else that had it wrong. If you have the physical card in-hand to get the exact (correct) text, please update the listing.


Last edited by woelf on Mon Feb 06, 2017 6:00 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Subject:    PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2017 9:21 pm Reply with quote

Thanks woelf, I'll see about editing the gallery entry for Dev.

The Homemade Flag combo is going to come up in my campaign, it's found it's way onto the Nubian Prince......
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Subject:    PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2017 9:47 pm Reply with quote

woelf wrote:
a7xfanben wrote:
Can I use Jailhouse Dog to eliminate a Maps of Alexandria that was turned face up by Pirate Globe?
Yes, but... why?


Simply to take the dog out of the game to deny the opposing fleet from using it (after a 10 master boards you heh) to destroy your valuable Barbary Banner. Check out the latest T2 report for details. Very Happy

Quote:
The Homemade Flag combo is going to come up in my campaign, it's found it's way onto the Nubian Prince......


Ugh, I don't think I've dealt with that before. Another reason that ability shouldn't have appeared on anything bigger than 2 masts, or anything at all for that matter. (not OP on small ships but the sheer level of obnoxiousness is a 10/10)
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Subject:    PostPosted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 11:16 pm Reply with quote

Probably answered before but didn't see anything in the Code: can you ram a ship and tow another with the same move action? (side of my ship was in contact with the bow of a derelict and the bow was touching an enemy ship)
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Subject:    PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2017 2:09 am Reply with quote

a7xfanben wrote:
Probably answered before but didn't see anything in the Code: can you ram a ship and tow another with the same move action? (side of my ship was in contact with the bow of a derelict and the bow was touching an enemy ship)
That goes back to the old rule that a ship can only move into contact with one thing at a time (unless an ability like Switchblade specifically says otherwise).

You could ram a ship while you were towing another, but you can't ram one and start towing another at the same time.
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Subject:    PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2017 5:18 am Reply with quote

Big question here that could affect some results in Tournament #2:

You can see the situation below: Vengeance has canceller Lenoir aboard, and the French want to cancel Captain Blackheart aboard the Roanoke as soon as the AP's turn begins. However, the AP's still have their Hidden Cove. Basically, which happens first, or in other words which part of this section is most relevant?

The Pirate Code wrote:
Timing
-If two or more conflicting abilities or effects seem to occur at the same time, the player whose turn it is may choose the order in which they are applied unless specifically stated otherwise in the ability text or in this document.
-If an action or ability refers to a specific point in time (“beginning of your turn”, “before X”, “immediately after X”, etc.) it must be used at that time or it cannot be applied until the next time that situation occurs.
-If an ability or action does not specifically state that it applies at the beginning of a turn, it cannot be applied until after all “beginning of turn” abilities, actions, or other effects have been applied.
-If an action or ability does not refer to a specific point in time it may be applied when desired, provided that any and all other requirements (a specified range, a clear line of fire, physical contact, etc.) are met.


I thought that the third part made it clear that HC overrides the canceller, but the final part is confusing because the canceller ability says "once per turn" without specifying when. (and if the first part applies, the AP's would choose HC to apply first, at which time Lenoir wouldn't even be in range)
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