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Ranking: Top 10 Davy Jones' Curse Game Pieces

 
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Subject: Ranking: Top 10 Davy Jones' Curse Game Pieces   PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2017 11:01 pm Reply with quote

I volunteered to do both this and the MI set, so here goes nothing. I'm not quite as knowledgeable on the game as Ben is, but I tried my best, going through each and every piece to try to rank what struck me as the best ships and crew from this set. Obviously, I'll be skipping generic crew, and due to the fickle nature of UTs, I've excluded them too.

1. Sammy the Skull
Surprisingly, what I'd consider the single best piece from the set is the first rendition of Sammy the Skull. At six points, you get a captain that provides a boarding roll bonus, as well as the option of a linked crew with a powerful, if overpriced ability. Boarding bonuses are worth four points, so Sammy is actually one point cheaper than he should be.

2. Blackwatch
An absurdly powerful gunship, Blackwatch has what is effectively a 1L-1L-1L-2L-2L armament, and a fair cargo space with which she can be stocked with potent crew. This is easily among the game's best gunships, though not quite El Acorazado [SM] tier.

3. Santo Columba/HMS Bretwalda
Same price, size, armament, but different strengths nonetheless. Bretwalda is about making full use of her powerful broadside, with the ability to level up to five masts in one roll, whereas Columba is more equipped for boarding, though is theoretically just as powerful a gunship, given the right crew.

4. HMS Guy Fawkes/El Monte Cristo
These two are more or less the same ship. 11 points, three masts, world hater abilities. Guy Fawkes gets more hold space at the expense of marginally weaker armament. Both make for powerful support gunships or budget main gunships.

5. Mohican
Almost on the level of the ships above, Mohican is equally priced and armed, but her ability sets her apart from those two. She is capable, however, of accepting some of the game's best crew due to her ability, so she can be shrewdly crewed to almost match Guy Fawkes or Monte Cristo.

6. Selkie
For nine points, you get a ship with good hold space, respectable armament, and a fair offensive ability that opens the possibility of getting the first strike on more expensive, more powerful gunships. I'm willing to bet this is among the game's best Flotilla tugs, because of how well her ability, armament, and cost pair with them.

7. Derrik the Red
I'm not a user of SAC, but this crew's combination of world-hater and SAC abilities left an impression on me. Certainly not the best SAC crew, but a viable option nonetheless.

8. Le Bonaparte
I needn't say much. Excellent defensive ability, good speed, acceptable guns and hold space. She can fit enough crew to make her an excellent primary gunship, one that can intercept gold runners or sink enemy gunships with nearly no fear of taking damage.

9. La Corse
What do we have here? A 4/5ths scale El Acorazado/Constitution, but French. Almost as big a pain to take down as its bigger siblings, but at 4/5 points cheaper respectively, she's a great choice if you can't quite budget the aforementioned juggernauts into your fleet.

10. Guichuan/The Headhunter
You can't not mention the best of the ten masters. The best armament of any of any ten masted ship, and the hold space and point cost to accommodate some of the most powerful Cursed crew in the game, she's a total powerhouse of a ship, especially in larger games, when you can afford to crew her to her potential... with the problem being affording this ship. She comes in at 37 points, which is the single most expensive base cost of any ship in the game, as she's required to have The Headhunter on board. She's almost unusable in 40 point games without a build limit booster, and even then, you can only afford a couple of the game's cheapest gold runner options.

I wrote my list before I realized Ben was doing honorable mentions, too, so, uh... here's what I can come up with offhand. Behemoth, Davy Jones, Mist Walker, Flying Dutchman, Hellfire

Dishonorable mention: Burning Man
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Subject:    PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 2:12 am Reply with quote

Great list! =) See, this is why I like others doing this, because we all see value in different ways. And I see things very differently than this list, heh. DJC has been one of my least favorite sets, because outside of a few ships on this list, the set is pretty weak and you of course have the scratching issue.

Here is how I would rank:

1) Le Bonaparte - this has to be #1. It has the single best ship ability in the game, and if it had one more cargo spot it might be one of the most OP ships in the game (Although with the RtSS Captain/SAT combo, I think she reaches that status)

2) Blackwatch - totally agree with your assessment here

3) Santo Columba - again a ship I reviewed. I don't value BRetwalda the same because I dislike broadsides, and she is slower.

4) Davy Jones - its freakin Davy Jones! =) Seriously though, he is the eponymous Cursed character and although his other version is probably more useful, his ability has never been copied in another crew

5) Executioner - the best Cursed gunship, hands down. This has to be on the list.

6) Flying Dutchman - with only the speed weakness, it still stands as a great ship and the most famous Cursed ship

7) Derrik the Red - great combo of abilities

8.) Sea Monkey - the cursed don't have much for treasure running, and if you either do that or use her as a hybrid, she is one of the best the cursed have to offer I think.

9) La Charlemagne - who doesn't love another Vanilla good French 5 master? Better than BRetwalda in my opinion in most ways.

10) Behemoth - its the best one, and Sea Monsters were introduced here, so it has to be ranked.

Other HR that you did not mention: Harbinger, HMS Half Moon

Why I left others out:
1) Sammy - a great card, and yes its a deal, but nothing special to me, and I actually like the other version better heh

2) BRetwalda - Would probably have been #11 for me

3) Guy Fawkes/Monte/MOhican - Monte is pretty worthless with 2 cargo - she is too slow to be useful, and there is no other option than Capt/Helm combo. Guy Fawkes is a little better - at least you could sneak Myngs on there to help him out. Mohican is probably my favorite of the three, due to the ability, but not good enough for my list.

4) Selkie - I love the Irish name, but to me that ability is worthless with guns that good, and she is too slow to pull a flotilla.

5) La Corse - worthy of an Honorable mention for sure, but I kind of undervalue that ability

6) Guichan - don't get me started. Totally worthless in normal games, and frankly not the best 10 master - that is the Zeus - its cheaper and has better crew options and is actually usable.
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Subject:    PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 4:33 am Reply with quote

volt wrote:
4) Davy Jones - its freakin Davy Jones! =) Seriously though, he is the eponymous Cursed character and although his other version is probably more useful, his ability has never been copied in another crew
5) Executioner - the best Cursed gunship, hands down. This has to be on the list.
6) Flying Dutchman - with only the speed weakness, it still stands as a great ship and the most famous Cursed ship
8.) Sea Monkey - the cursed don't have much for treasure running, and if you either do that or use her as a hybrid, she is one of the best the cursed have to offer I think.
9) La Charlemagne - who doesn't love another Vanilla good French 5 master? Better than BRetwalda in my opinion in most ways.
10) Behemoth - its the best one, and Sea Monsters were introduced here, so it has to be ranked.
Other HR that you did not mention: Harbinger, HMS Half Moon
Why I left others out:
2) BRetwalda - Would probably have been #11 for me
4) Selkie - I love the Irish name, but to me that ability is worthless with guns that good, and she is too slow to pull a flotilla.
5) La Corse - worthy of an Honorable mention for sure, but I kind of undervalue that ability
6) Guichan - don't get me started. Totally worthless in normal games, and frankly not the best 10 master - that is the Zeus - its cheaper and has better crew options and is actually usable.

Thanks! I'm doing the MI list next week, which may be really controversial, given some of the choices I've picked. I think overall MI was the weakest set, though that hasn't deterred me from trying to collect a complete set of it.

- I personally wouldn't rate Davy Jones that high. He may be iconic, versatile, and powerful, but his cost is prohibitive, he has the Limit keyword, and doesn't strike me as cost-effective.
- Executioner is definitely a more competent gunship than Hellfire, but also significantly more expensive. I give Hellfire the edge due to the fact that I think you overpay for Executioner's extra speed and marginally better firepower.
- Flying Dutchman is one of those ships that I think someone described as "overrated by newbies, underrated by veterans" or something like that. She's an excellent gunship, no doubt about it, but not quite HMS Titan/San Cristobal tier, so she didn't make my list.
- Sea Monkey is one of those ships that I look at and think, "meh." I don't doubt for a moment that she's a solid gold runner, but by god is she expensive. Sure, she's quick, has a good hold, and a fitting ability, but I don't think I'd ever use her outside of a large game in which i know my gold ships will be preyed upon.
- Hmm, you may have a point. That said, I think La Charlemagne is more comparable to the Spanish sister ship given their emphasis on boarding. Given the right crew setup, Le Charlemagne could make for an excellent boarding interceptor.
- Behemoth I again struggle to put on the list because of its weakness— being a sea monster, which made it a profoundly overpriced unit. I think Behemoth should have never been any more than 16 points. I love its copy ability, but I don't think it's quite as useful in practice as it looks on paper. It's just too expensive for what you get.
- I think DJC's Harbinger is too slow to make good use of its ability. Isn't a great package considering what's available for that price.
- That's fair regarding Bretwalda. I maintain that she's an excellent ship, though.
- When you tow a flotilla, though, your base move is reduced to S (AFAIK), so it's a bad idea to choose a fast ship to tow something when your movement is limited in the first place. Going from L to S (and then S+S with a Helmsman) isn't a bad tradeoff for what really amounts to firepower that rivals a kraken, but with better utility.
- La Corse's worthy of no less than an HM, and if you ask me, fully deserving of her spot on the list. Let's wait for Ben to weigh in with his opinion— he may do anything from agree with you to demand it be higher up on the list! Very Happy
- Yeah, I think the Zeus may be close to the Guichuan, and she definitely has better crew choices, though her base firepower is distinctly average. The crew you can give her are limited, because her 23 point cost disallows you from stacking named crew like you can on Guichuan, lest you use one of those crew that can allow surpassing a ship's standard point limit, though they usually come at a cost.

Can't wait to post my MI list next week. It'll be interesting hearing your thoughts on that list and set when the time comes.
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Subject:    PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 5:14 am Reply with quote

godmason wrote:
Can't wait to post my MI list next week. It'll be interesting hearing your thoughts on that list and set when the time comes.


Gotta go to bed finally, I'll comment on the rest of this tomorrow. You might want to wait a bit longer than a week based on the poll.
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Subject:    PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 5:51 am Reply with quote

Interesting lists, both of you. I agree with some of your rankings, disagree with others.I suppose mine would be something like this:

1) Le Bonaparte


Previously only available on the Nubian Prince and Prince ofChichester, this ship comes close to breaking the game, simply because of a piece released in the same set. She's the best equipped ship with this ability, her access to French crew gives er all kinds of fun combinations that are not possible on either of the previous iterations of this ability.


2) Blackwatch


I agree with both your number 2 picks, and not just because the BW was the first ship I ever pulled. XD After the Enterprise (and maybe the TJ/Bonhomme Richard) this was the best American gunship. Later sets would have ships that outshine her, but few can come close to matching her near perfect guns.


3) Davy Jones


Yes, expensive, but the possibilities Jones opened up are still to fully discovered to this day. There had never been an ability like this before, and it has only appeared (deservedly so) on one other Cursed piece, not like the All-Powerful, which should NEVER have gone to the Pirates. I think his cost and Limit abilities are worth it considering what you get out of him. The only 'limit' is what's available on the sea for your choosing. Also, his status as the master of the Cursed cannot be overlooked.


4) Executioner


Until the Grinder was released in RotF, this was the best Cursed gunship. No other Cursed vessel has that speed naturally built in, or has cannons like that. The good stuff costs more, which is why even though the Hellfire may be less expensive, the Executioner is MUCH better at sinking ships. Properly outfitted, I've seen her wipe my entire fleet out over the course of two turns.


5) Santo Columba/ Harbinger


The SC is faster and has more accurate cannons overall than the Hrabinger, but the Harbinger is larger, and by virtue of being pirate is almost as good, which is why I've ranked them together. Like Volt, I value the S-Board ability, and these two are VERY similar in terms of effectiveness. Spain has lots of good crew options to but on the SC, from cheap SAT/EA crew, to boarding bonus fellows, and the same goes for the Pirates and then some. Anything anyone has in this game, the Pirates have it as well, and sometimes better.


6) La Corse


Like her cousins from Spanish Main and Revolution, the Corse is another tough to hit ship. If I had to rate the ships that have this ability, the Corse comes 2nd, ahead of the Constitution, if only because the French have more crew options than the Americans, such cheap SAT/EA crew. Taken here in Davy Jones Curse, she falls here mainly because of her point cost relative to size, and her average cannons and base speed.


7)George Washington LeBeaux/Jean Desailly/Tsuro


These three all have the same ability, therefore I rank them together. Each introduced a brand-new ability to the game, and is the first ability that let you MOVE an opposing ship. True this ability is circumstantial, and only moves a ship L, but is useful in conjunction with other abilities such as All-Powerful. Additionally, you can use the L movement to bring a ship into range of an otherwise stationary target, like a Sea Monster, or a Fort.


8 )HMS Bretwalda


The only ship with Broadsides Attack built in that I'd consider using her Keyword with. She has near-perfect guns, and her firepower is something to behold. She falls here on my list because she has limited cargo space.


9)The Inquisitor/White Crew


These two have almost the exact same ability, and this was the first time crew elimination had been seen on such a large scale. Crew elimination had been around since day one, but it had either relied on a cannon shot, or being pinned to the enemy ship. Never before had it been tied to winning a boarding party. This ability alone makes a boarding attempt worth it, the possibility to eliminate an entire ship worth of crew will go a long way to hampering how effective that ship is.


10)Behemoth


Indeed, the best Sea Monster ever released in the game, and the only other piece to have the Copy ability. Most Sea Creatures are not capable ot offense on their own, this one is, and that makes it not only the best Sea Monster, but the best Sea Creature. Her speed and 'cannons' are average, and her Limit keyword is her only drawback, otherwise she's as good as a Sea Monster gets. That is why she's here at the 10 spot, and not above, as she is a Sea Monster, and they do have flaws.


Honorable Mentions (in no particular order):
Guichuan
Sea Monkey
Papa Doc
La Charlemange
El Cristal del Obispo
Bonny Peel
Paul Revere
Chariot of the Gods
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Subject:    PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 7:56 pm Reply with quote

godmason wrote:

- I personally wouldn't rate Davy Jones that high. He may be iconic, versatile, and powerful, but his cost is prohibitive, he has the Limit keyword, and doesn't strike me as cost-effective.


I don't understand then how you can rank Guichan? It's picture is next to "cost prohibitive" in the dictionary heh.

godmason wrote:

- Executioner is definitely a more competent gunship than Hellfire, but also significantly more expensive. I give Hellfire the edge due to the fact that I think you overpay for Executioner's extra speed and marginally better firepower.


To me, you can NEVER overpay for speed. Speed wins games. You do overpay for fear, but you are also getting 2 more cargo.

godmason wrote:

- Behemoth I again struggle to put on the list because of its weakness— being a sea monster, which made it a profoundly overpriced unit. I think Behemoth should have never been any more than 16 points. I love its copy ability, but I don't think it's quite as useful in practice as it looks on paper. It's just too expensive for what you get.


As stated by Xerecs, its the only sea monster that can sport its own captain. It is definitely overpriced, but Sea Monsters in general are so bad, this one just stands out to me.

godmason wrote:

- When you tow a flotilla, though, your base move is reduced to S (AFAIK), so it's a bad idea to choose a fast ship to tow something when your movement is limited in the first place. Going from L to S (and then S+S with a Helmsman) isn't a bad tradeoff for what really amounts to firepower that rivals a kraken, but with better utility.


Yeah, you are confused there. When you tow a derelict, your base speed becomes S. But when you tow a flotilla you keep your base speed, but cannot use any speed modifiers to change it (so no helmsman). That is why I said it is too slow - it can only go L when towing a flotilla.

godmason wrote:

- La Corse's worthy of no less than an HM, and if you ask me, fully deserving of her spot on the list. Let's wait for Ben to weigh in with his opinion— he may do anything from agree with you to demand it be higher up on the list! Very Happy


I don't disagree here. But there are ways around that ability, and one well placed firepot can ruin your day. Still, its French, so its already good Wink

godmason wrote:

- Yeah, I think the Zeus may be close to the Guichuan, and she definitely has better crew choices, though her base firepower is distinctly average. The crew you can give her are limited, because her 23 point cost disallows you from stacking named crew like you can on Guichuan, lest you use one of those crew that can allow surpassing a ship's standard point limit, though they usually come at a cost.


But you proved my point - at huge point games, sure the Guichan is good, but your argument for adding crew is why I think Guichan is even worse. To get any good Cursed crew on there costs you a fortune. All you have to do is add a worldhater and boom for 27 points - less than GUichan - you get just as good if not better guns. Add a 3 pt SAT the pirates have and you equal Guichan's points and you have a SAT built in, AND its already going faster. How can you compare that? Sure, Treasure ship can be a nice ability, but are you really boarding and running treasure with this thing? To me its just not worth it in a game less than 100 points, which to me is pretty much every game.

I await Ben's thoughts =)
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Subject: Wow this is difficult.   PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 9:09 pm Reply with quote

OK finally I can read and comment on all this, I love the comprehensive rankings and long posts here!!

@godmason: Actually, +1 to boarding rolls is worth 2 points, as it was back in the Spanish Main. They changed it to 3 (and 4 in some cases) for no good reason, as the ability is definitely not worth more than 2 points as one of the most overrated and common abilities in the entire game. Sammy the Skull is actually only worth 5 points. Santo Columba is mostly better than the Bretwalda due to speed and cargo space, but S boarding is also less risky than BA. I'm glad you have the Guy Fawkes, Monte Cristo, and Mohican so high - they're definitely underrated! I've LOVED the Selkie since I first got her, she's one of the most fun and exciting ships in the Pirate faction (you want a ship with S+L speed or faster for towing flotillas however). Also, the Guichuan is absolutely NOT the best of the 10 masters haha, I don't know why you and wantkrakens are so set on that! Smile

Gotta disagree on Behemoth though - that ability is insanely good on a sea monster because of the captain keyword. You can remain submerged until you're in position and then pop up and shoot (immune underwater unless canceller/etc). Also, Behemoth could copy defensive abilities like the Bonaparte if it gets into trouble.

The Harbinger doesn't need to use its ability, it's a good 5 masted ship in the first place. It also has tons of great Pirate options for increasing its speed. If you really want a ship that is too slow to use its abilities, the Guichuan is your ship. Laughing Ghost Ship is almost out of the question unless going in a straight line with double actions, the Junk keyword isn't as useful with S range guns and you won't catch as much even at 4S. Plus the Treasure Ship keyword is harder to use since it takes so long to make trips and gather gold - a competent opponent can force you into using the ship as either a gold runner or gunship, as she's pretty slow to get to both strategies in most games.

Evidently you didn't see my comment on your Stingray review, make sure you get the Pirate Code and Master Keyword List from BoardGameGeek. Towing a flotilla is not the same as towing a derelict.

The Zeus has firepower nearly as good as the Guichuan and has better speed for 7 (14!) less points. The Pirates often have better named crew than the Cursed for far less points (the difference between these two factions' named crew is staggering), so you don't need the Zeus to cost 30 points. An effective setup on the Zeus could cost 40 points compared to 50-60 for a roughly similar setup on the Guichuan.

Like I said, try to wait more than a week before MI, especially with all the great discussion going on here!

@volt: I don't see DJC as weak overall, I think it's a pretty solid set. The named crew are especially interesting and good in a variety of cases, with plenty of underrated ships and good set balance. Perhaps it suffers from its reputation and because the sets that came before it were mostly better (excluding some of BC). Should be HM for Honorable Mentions I think.

@Xerecs: Well the Pirates don't have a 0LR reroller (or the copy ability, or a ship like the Acorazado/Constitution/Corse, etc). (sorry)

I think the L movers are too luck-based and gimmicky to make this list (especially Tsuro). Was your ranking of them influenced by CG1? Wink Also surprised you didn't mention tossing large ships on reefs, or flat earth rules.

I mean you could always eliminate a crew by winning a boarding party, just not all of them at once. I don't see how those crew are better than Bonny Peel and Derrik the Red. In big games with other wackiness going on (Wraith, saccing, again CG1 lol), they become more useful, but in games at 60 points or less there won't be as many crew available to kill, not to mention how high a percentage of your build total those 7 points take up.

Behemoth's guns are definitely not average... average is about 3S, that difference is absolutely massive (for example, some people think 4's are worthless and 3's are good/decent when the percentages aren't that much different, gives an insight to how big the number difference makes). Also there aren't many other sea creatures that have all rank-2 guns, regardless of range.

Hooray for the Cristal and Paul Revere! (surprised nobody else mentioned the Cristal)

~~~~~

Indeed, I think this Davy Jones (unlike the other one) is not very cost effective. He's best suited to specific roles, such as copying HMS Lucy's Luck or the Bonaparte when aboard a 10 master. I feel like he hasn't been used enough in standard games (certainly not by me at least) to really know his value and placement on the list. A huge wild card. Again I'm not giving bonus points because the set is named after him, this is (mostly) objective logical reasoning not a popularity contest.

I think I said that about the Flying Dutchman ("overrated by newbies, underrated by veterans"). The speed and wasted points on BA really holds her back. Would be absolutely fantastic with S+S speed and an appropriately priced (see: 2 points) Fear keyword for about 15 or 16 points. I have a soft spot for the Sea Monkey and she's a pretty solid ship.

godmason wrote:
La Corse's worthy of no less than an HM, and if you ask me, fully deserving of her spot on the list. Let's wait for Ben to weigh in with his opinion— he may do anything from agree with you to demand it be higher up on the list!


I actually underrate and sometimes forget about the Corse because of how amazing the Acorazado and Constitution are. Also, I don't want to make any demands, since these are our personal opinions - other than demanding that volt stop demanding that something "has" to be on the list (you can say that about the Banshee's Cry and Bonaparte, but not quite for the Behemoth and Executioner).

Our thoughts on the Monte Cristo (and Hellfire by extension) further show our playing differences. I would normally put double action crew on ships with at least 4 masts, and the Cristo and Guy Fawkes have mainly played support gunship roles in my games (almost like a 74 gun ship-of-the-line that just serves its place in battle). This is partly due to the large games I play, there are plenty of 5 masters to give double action crew to, so 3 masters are usually left with generics. The Executioner's cargo space cannot be ignored - if she's one of the best Cursed gunships, it makes sense to give her one of the best Cursed crew - either the OE or RotF versions of Fantasma. The Hellfire can't hold those crew effectively with a captain and helmsman, so the combination of how the cargo hold helps the Executioner's speed is one reason she beats the Hellfire, who similar to the Monte Cristo can mostly just hold a captain and helmsman.

Evidently other people use crew more than me... the Bretwalda's 3 cargo spaces are enough for (example) Myngs/0LR reroller Owen, captain, helmsman, and oarsman. I wouldn't need much else for a gunship (plus you could use Gold/Gunn from RotF instead and add more if you really wanted to).

Here is my list:

1. Le Bonaparte

Especially after CG1, I absolutely despise this ship. This is one of the best abilities in the game, yes, but the most annoying. Really awful having to face it in a game... I don't think this ability should exist. The schooner keyword just makes it even easier to abuse.

2. Blackwatch

WE AGREE ON SOMETHING!!

3. Santo Columba / Harbinger

I like the Harbinger a lot better, but the Santo Columba does have nice speed and roughly equivalent firepower.

~~~~~

This is where the rankings got a lot harder for me.

4. Executioner

Speed and cannons win more typical games (<100 points) than the Corse's ability.

5. La Corse

6. La Charlemange

7. El Cristal del Obispo

Hello out there? Prior to this it seemed like everyone was overrating this ship, now she's being underrated...

8. Sea Monkey

Great potential hybrid for the Cursed, though I have a feeling she's too high here. Really tough set to rank!

9. Selkie / HMS Guy Fawkes / El Monte Cristo / Mohican

Great mid-size gunships with different strengths. Selkie is my personal favorite and likely the best due to point cost and cargo hold.

10. Davy Jones / Behemoth

Obviously the crew is much more versatile, but he makes Behemoth an 8 point sea monster with great guns! I basically need to use both of these more - I think DJC Davy Jones is one of the least understood crew in the game (as Xerecs mentioned), and I myself have extremely high doubts about this ranking (might be too low or too high, likely not too low for Behemoth however).

I really might change my list here. I'm really conflicted. As a result of it being so close for me, I'm doing the end a little different here.

Just missed:

11. Paul Revere

I'm really annoyed about leaving this one off and I want to talk about it. Lol. This ship costs just a point more than the Bretwalda, but gives you much better speed and good firepower. Her ability is also less useless. I love this ship way too much and I'm starting to worry about it. XD

12. Derrik the Red

Another tough exclusion for me, I just don't see him as essential with so many other great Pirate crew. That confirms I'm sinking too far into volt's line of thought (for me at least) about factions though... ugh. I don't know what to do here.

13. HMS Bretwalda

Something about this ship doesn't do it for me, despite my love of the English and accurate cannons. I think it's the fact that the guns are the only standout thing. Crappy ability (still wouldn't use it unless in the right situation, such as against the Acorazado), mediocre speed, somewhat below average cargo space.

14. HMS Half Moon

A very solid, underrated English ship that can mostly be used for gold but also serves well as a hybrid and treasure raider.

15. Guichuan w/Headhunter

A lot has already been said; I feel this ship is almost similar to Davy Jones and Bonny Peel in a way... it can be all-or-nothing in gameplay, and many players either swear by it or dismiss it altogether.

Other just missed (but by more than 11-15 lol): Hessian , Flying Dutchman , Bonny Peel , El Raton , Maps of Hades , Eye of Insanity

Honorable Mentions: Calim (surprised nobody mentioned), Hangman's Joke, Loa's Justice , Nightmare , Tabatha McWarren , Chief PO Charles Richard , HMS Bath , Commander Spencer Portland , Jacques, Duc de Valois , L'Eroica , Le Republicain , Pequod , Cursed Conch , Chariot of the Gods , Mist Walker , HMS Richards , Salem
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Joined: 25 Jun 2015
Posts: 55

Subject:    PostPosted: Fri Jun 02, 2017 11:07 pm Reply with quote

Ah, the very first set I bought. I still have memories of my group, as elementary students, tacking on abilities to the Flying Dutchman and the sea monsters to make them like in the Pirates of the Caribbean movies.
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volt
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Joined: 03 Apr 2011
Posts: 703

Subject: Re: Wow this is difficult.   PostPosted: Sat Jun 03, 2017 6:17 pm Reply with quote

a7xfanben wrote:
I actually underrate and sometimes forget about the Corse because of how amazing the Acorazado and Constitution are. Also, I don't want to make any demands, since these are our personal opinions - other than demanding that volt stop demanding that something "has" to be on the list (you can say that about the Banshee's Cry and Bonaparte, but not quite for the Behemoth and Executioner).


lol. When I say it has to be on the list, I meant *my* list, not everyone elses =) (Although cough those were both on your list hehe)

Also, re: Obispo, I do like her and kinda forgot about her. She barely made the top 10 spanish gunships if I recall though, so for me should would still be an HM.
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a7xfanben
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Joined: 27 Jun 2011
Posts: 4598

Subject: Re: Wow this is difficult.   PostPosted: Sat Jun 03, 2017 6:21 pm Reply with quote

volt wrote:
a7xfanben wrote:
I actually underrate and sometimes forget about the Corse because of how amazing the Acorazado and Constitution are. Also, I don't want to make any demands, since these are our personal opinions - other than demanding that volt stop demanding that something "has" to be on the list (you can say that about the Banshee's Cry and Bonaparte, but not quite for the Behemoth and Executioner).


lol. When I say it has to be on the list, I meant *my* list, not everyone elses =) (Although cough those were both on your list hehe)

Also, re: Obispo, I do like her and kinda forgot about her. She barely made the top 10 spanish gunships if I recall though, so for me should would still be an HM.


Yeah you said "has to be on the list", not "my" list. I also typed that comment before I even made my list. It was more because some of the choices godmason had above them made sense.
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